Mortal change people are requesting

General discussion pertaining to the Demise shard. Off-topic posts will be moderated.
Josh
Posts: 1314

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Josh »

Josh wrote: You focused on “I DONT MORTAL SPAM,” and avoided the discussion entirely. But yea man you “proved me wrong.” Aight, you don’t always mortal spam, I’ll concede that, it doesn’t matter to the overall discussionz then I stopped typing originally Bc I could see you were going just do some retarded shit and focus on some shit that didn’t matter in the overall discussion.

(Hint about argumentation and how it works: say “I don’t do that,” here’s an example then answer the rest of the discussion, don’t pretend I’m the one deflecting and you somehow proved me wrong dipshit, proving one small non-sequetor doesn’t mean your entire argument is true).
This is the post I conceded you dont always mortal spam, was a few posts back.
Josh wrote:
Loler wrote:Theres a video of chad dieng 1v5 and a video of script dieing 1v3. I use 1 mortal to kill both players. I don't spam mortal the Dr won't have an affect on me it just doesn't belong in this era.

And im sorry you post 15 different posts plus im not on my computer to see every little thing you posted. He'll as i posted this message you posted the 3rd time in a row
Lol, yet you’ve posted everytime, I’m on my phone too.
As per the 3 posts, 1 was 1 sentence, the 2nd was a clarifying question and the 3rd was just giving you reasons why you’re retarded for thinking you proved me wrong.

When you focus on things that aren’t related to the overall argument, that’s not proving someone wrong on the overall topic.

P.s. I conceded the you mortal spam thing (don’t care enough to watch videos or argue it), it doesn’t mean anything within the overall discussion.
This is the most recent post, says basically the same thing as the first.

I said you mortal spam, I removed the "you dont want bc it'll nerf you" bc I felt it was redundant.

I conceded that two posts ago (the ones directed at you).

Josh wrote:
Loler wrote:Yeah spamming mortal 1v5 and 1v3 mate wouldn't be able go do that with a Dr or immunity.
Confused by what this means bc the sentence structure is retarded. Are you saying mortal spam is good for 1v5 1v3 and you wouldn’t be able to do that with diminishing returns or immunity?

If you’re saying you need mortal spam for 1v5s and 1v3s, then I don’t think you understand what the word “balanced” means. Balance discussions should be generally focused on even fights not outnumbered fights.
edit: this was the post before the first quote of mine on this thread.

I asked for clarification on this one, bc the sentence structure was weird. It might be what you're confused about where "i kept proving points" or whatever. I didn't mean for it to be about you mortal spamming in particular just that balance discussions shouldn't be about outnumbered fights rather it should be based on even numbered fights. Because being able to kill someone 1v3 or 1v5 better supports the argument that it's op than it's good to have.

TL;DR im not making points about you mortal spamming anymore, I conceded you might not spam, then made arguments about why the proposal is balanced and shit talked a little, of course.
Loler
Posts: 2485

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Loler »

"Because being able to kill someone 1v3 or 1v5 better supports the argument that it's op than it's good to have."

I was the one they were the 3 and 5. I didn't spam it. Change literally would do nothing to me in 95% of the time I play an archer.

I'll say it again. I am against this change because it is way past our cut off. I would rather not see more and more things implemented past our cut off cause after a certain point everything is fair game and I would rather not see 37 mod items and 1300 skill point templates.

Also sorry that my sentence structure is shit when I type on my phone. It's hard enough to type on a phone for me with these big ole meat claws. I usually don't use any punctuation on my phone and instead any that is uses is put in from auto correct or miss clicks. All good either way. No thanks to mortal change supporting evidence in OP have a nice day.
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Vander Nars
Posts: 2130

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Vander Nars »

Loler wrote:You can give whatever info you want the change they are asking for is years past cut off. Im just letting the gms know
Scared you gonna have a play a mage in the field for once?
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Josh
Posts: 1314

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Josh »

Loler wrote:"Because being able to kill someone 1v3 or 1v5 better supports the argument that it's op than it's good to have."

I was the one they were the 3 and 5. I didn't spam it. Change literally would do nothing to me in 95% of the time I play an archer.

I'll say it again. I am against this change because it is way past our cut off. I would rather not see more and more things implemented past our cut off cause after a certain point everything is fair game and I would rather not see 37 mod items and 1300 skill point templates.

Also sorry that my sentence structure is shit when I type on my phone. It's hard enough to type on a phone for me with these big ole meat claws. I usually don't use any punctuation on my phone and instead any that is uses is put in from auto correct or miss clicks. All good either way. No thanks to mortal change supporting evidence in OP have a nice day.
Its cool, i was asking clarification.
And that's fair about being past the cut off. But I think it's a more preferable change for most pvmers than a mana leech change, which would be the alternative (if we're trying to change spamming). It would definitely hurt your sampire.
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Legacy
Posts: 448

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Legacy »

Am I the only one who thinks mortal, remove curse and apples are fine as is?

I rarely die because of mortal spam alone. We have people with remove curse in our guild in case it's needed.

Template diversity, folks! Rely more on your team and less on crutches!
Lucifall
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Mister Pink
Posts: 129

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Mister Pink »

Balance is everything.

IF there are too many of one particular template it's the result of being overpowered, easy to play, or easy to suit up. OR a combo of all three.

After years of heartwood abuse its definitely easy to acquire elite weapons in comparison to everything else.
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The Silvertiger
Posts: 4469

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by The Silvertiger »

Mister Pink wrote:Balance is everything.

IF there are too many of one particular template it's the result of being overpowered, easy to play, or easy to suit up. OR a combo of all three.

After years of heartwood abuse its definitely easy to acquire elite weapons in comparison to everything else.
So you're saying an archer meets 2 out of 3?
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Mister Pink
Posts: 129

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Mister Pink »

The Silvertiger wrote:
Mister Pink wrote:Balance is everything.

IF there are too many of one particular template it's the result of being overpowered, easy to play, or easy to suit up. OR a combo of all three.

After years of heartwood abuse its definitely easy to acquire elite weapons in comparison to everything else.
So you're saying an archer meets 2 out of 3?
Archery is the lowest skill of melee templates. Suiting up is costly, but this is an old shard so easier than any other place to get what you need. Weapons are plentiful enough, due to Heartwood abuse, that more than a few can field an Archer with seemingly endless mortals.

For a time the only Archer with great bows/ suit on the server was Predator. Maybe 3-4 years ago? Now it seems everyone has an Archer.

Casting change increases need for skill on mage. No more OP teleports. Seems logical most bad mages will just play their archers more.

Maybe I'm wrong.
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Grifo
Posts: 1587

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Grifo »

I know archers pvping with macro if yellowhits 'enemy' useability 'primary' else useability 'secondary' endif

Just one hotkey flooding mortal


Lol
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Josh
Posts: 1314

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Josh »

Legacy wrote:Am I the only one who thinks mortal, remove curse and apples are fine as is?

I rarely die because of mortal spam alone. We have people with remove curse in our guild in case it's needed.

Template diversity, folks! Rely more on your team and less on crutches!
It’s not that I die to it a lot to it, it’s just it’s annoying when it happens especially in group fights.

But mortal spamming is a crutch too though :P.

Idk what the template diversity thing is about? Mortal spam doesn’t really invite diversity (doesn’t really hurt it either lol).
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Legacy
Posts: 448

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Legacy »

Josh wrote:It’s not that I die to it a lot to it, it’s just it’s annoying when it happens especially in group fights.

But mortal spamming is a crutch too though :P.

Idk what the template diversity thing is about? Mortal spam doesn’t really invite diversity (doesn’t really hurt it either lol).

Ever since the advent of Apples, Ecrus etc, everyone is basically an alchy variation with apples, be it mages or archers. But before that people used 4/6 chivalry templates to compensante debuffs. So the team was something like this:

High necro necro guy for wither and strangle
Pure mage with med for big damage dumps
SW mage guy for area interuption (this could be also the chiv guy if he was a dexxer) (before the custom SW nerf basically everyone was SW, also)
50 chiv mage with 2/6 or 4/6 69,9 magery chiv mage for debuff removal
Dismounter guy to make sure the guy stays in range
Archer (ninja, necro, chiv, whatever)
Tank mage guy for finishing/heal blocks (this was usually me)
Alchy mages were basically used for choke point breaking and quick champion kills as EP was much harder to get

Mortal was whored just as much as now, but we counted on our team to remove it instead of an item. We'd wall, para field, remove curse, invis and wait with a g-heal, area interupt etc to make sure the enemy team couldn1t finish our guy. Now it's basically pray for apple timer while holding g-heal.

Given that situation, my job then was basically to make the support guy's life Hell, which I did, but I'd have to adapt all the time because everyone had a different template.

I dunno, I think we should first see how the community adapts to this OSI casting + UOSteam features disabled before thinking about changing mortal or apples. If people start playing more diverse templates to compensante for mortal spam (or anything spam) then that's a win in my book.
Lucifall
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Josh
Posts: 1314

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Josh »

I mean fair, you can have a dedicated xhealer, we’ve had those before.
But I don’t care too much about 30s apples for mortal.
I like the apples for curse/strangle but I can see why apple buffs might not be a great idea.

The main thing I support is the diminishing returns or immunity. I think dexxers should have to time their specials not just spam a special that prevents healing for 8s continuously (outside of confidence, hpr).
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desalonne
Posts: 439

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by desalonne »

Loler wrote:
Bama wrote:Garbs are past cut off
And wind had immunity added to it as well which it shouldn't. The reason im posting this is so things don't get changed because people don't actually know how it works on osi buy cry enough to get things changed.
Its really funny that you are talking about osi changes but realistically osi didnt have 99% of the issues that demise has due to mass amounts of afk obtained and crafted end game gear. Yea some people had end game suits on osi by the end of ML but the vast majority of players were not running around with 1/3 50ep ecrus with 10 sdi or having perfect 4 mod bows and suits to accommodate spamming mortal all day. Pretty sure archers are also supposed to receive 50% reduced mana leech (which they dont on demise) as well as im fairly certain specials are supposed to double is cost after each use to also prevent archers/dexxers from being able to spam specs indefinitely.
desalonne
Posts: 439

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by desalonne »

Side note. Tons of things implemented on demise (garbs, trinkets ect.) Are past ML cut off. But if were gonna argue about being 100% era accurate then wheres the faction arties. Lets make hiryus actually dismount. Lets have summons actually attack (orc brute, death adders ect.) And let them preform their specials accordingly. You cant just say dont change mortal cause osi didnt change this balance issue until a later patch simply because you only play an archer and cant field fight on a mage. Obviously osi realized it was in need of balancing and balanced it. Last i checked demises new message was to be as osi accurate while giving it the qol/balance changes needed for the era.
Loler
Posts: 2485

Re: Mortal change people are requesting

Post by Loler »

Desa doesnt know about osi. Tribkets make the cut garbs do not. Items were so heavily duped on osi it was common to see identicle items on different people at the same time. Hell i personally know several people who duped bod books of 500 val hammers. You want to talk about a server being asked? There were 20+ servers to afk farm on and xfer your items to your main server. Really seems you have no clue about osi from 2005 to 2009.
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