Proposed pvp changes please discuss pros and cons

[The Silvertiger]

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Trammies unite! Heck yeah!
A lot of great points TL;DR stop your dogging, of the female variety.

[Arden]

The point of this thread is to have that disgussion minus the “dogging”
So post your thoughts

[Arden]

I will say that every change being “bitched about” has been asked in the bug thread already. Some over 2 years ago. So to zzilliizz how should we approach change when going through the correct channels are ignored?

I also think everyone wants the same thing ... players and fun. As it stands right now, most pvp guilds agree (even your guild) that pvp in Demise is dying. Very quickly and we are attempting to fix it. That is why proposed casting changes as fel only.

I feel the “trammies” should post. I have no idea why having to re-writing a script is an isssue. I already write my own. I don’t see how cu changes affect pvm... so tell me. Same goes for mortal spam and apples. If anything it would make pvm easier.

So my point is- please be specific with how changes will affect pvm. I see your point about casting and scripts. How about the rest ?

[Mister Pink]

I personally don't care much about the mechanics as long as there is balance. So I'm ok with changing everything to osi like standards. I prefer to play with an active population. I love the complexity of this game, and am too bought in to go elsewhere (not as much free time to learn a new game), hard to recreate UO. It's a nostalgia game first with spurts of competition.

That being said the main reason for the change is people are tired of fighting script pvpers. They want their skills to shine, and be a badass. Ok great you accomplish that, and now the majority of players that play here that depends on scripts to barely survive play like ass now. Are they going to adjust or just quit. They quit. Oh boy now we get the PvP crowd, two month on average people(my experience from pest). They complain, are cancerous to the community, mostly only play when victory is assured, have massive egos(as if this is some ultra competitive game). Nobody's getting sponsored mother fucker. They get bored because the people that play like ass quit and they don't have easy targets. Boom dead shard. But hey if it truly is at that point then sure go for it, but demise PvP is cyclical. Be dead for ages then have 25 people over 4 guilds fighting.

Just my thoughts

[The Silvertiger]

Kid, don’t try and twist what I’m saying. It’ll just make you look like a retard. What I said was either we go all osi casting in fel or all demise casting in fel. If you differentiate casting based on region like dungeons it’ll piss any newcomer off. Consistency is definitely #1 priority for field/choke pvp.
Now, you can have different versions of casting in duel pits but that’s about where you should draw the line.

Quoted from a different thread, but it makes sense here. I think if casting were to change in fel/all-over that an option for this arcade-style casting should be available in duel arenas. Perhaps even host arcade casting duel tournaments to go with our 7 man bomberruns.

[Josh]

Kid, don’t try and twist what I’m saying. It’ll just make you look like a retard. What I said was either we go all osi casting in fel or all demise casting in fel. If you differentiate casting based on region like dungeons it’ll piss any newcomer off. Consistency is definitely #1 priority for field/choke pvp.
Now, you can have different versions of casting in duel pits but that’s about where you should draw the line.

Quoted from a different thread, but it makes sense here. I think if casting were to change in fel/all-over that an option for this arcade-style casting should be available in duel arenas. Perhaps even host arcade casting duel tournaments to go with our 7 man bomberruns.

Sure, Im down with events being whatever casting.

[Josh]

I personally don't care much about the mechanics as long as there is balance. So I'm ok with changing everything to osi like standards. I prefer to play with an active population. I love the complexity of this game, and am too bought in to go elsewhere (not as much free time to learn a new game), hard to recreate UO. It's a nostalgia game first with spurts of competition.

That being said the main reason for the change is people are tired of fighting script pvpers. They want their skills to shine, and be a badass. Ok great you accomplish that, and now the majority of players that play here that depends on scripts to barely survive play like ass now. Are they going to adjust or just quit. They quit. Oh boy now we get the PvP crowd, two month on average people(my experience from pest). They complain, are cancerous to the community, mostly only play when victory is assured, have massive egos(as if this is some ultra competitive game). Nobody's getting sponsored mother fucker. They get bored because the people that play like ass quit and they don't have easy targets. Boom dead shard. But hey if it truly is at that point then sure go for it, but demise PvP is cyclical. Be dead for ages then have 25 people over 4 guilds fighting.

Just my thoughts

I don't think QA and SAS are the intended groups we are targeting (toxic pest douches you're talking about). The change would target a lot of former osi players or osi players who currently play, personally a lot of my friends stopped playing here because of the casting and would come back if it were changed.

Also, scripting isn't illegal post-patch, there are other scripts that'll work so they still have an option. Also, 90% of the players here rely on scripts, so the overall level of play will get worse and a few will shine sure but i doubt people will quit with the items and time investment they've put in. Also, if average play x gets slightly worse and average player y gets slightly worse, the skill level will drop but the median players will stay near each other in skill level.

Good players will win regardless, but why should scripting be prioritized? Why should someone who plays without scripts be at a detriment when playing vs a player with scripts? why not just allow a system that allows a way to combat the inhuman reactions? In my opinion osi-casting just levels the playing field for non-script vs scripting pvp. Yes, i want it personally because I would probably be a better player with it than demise casting, but honestly the best reasoning is a question of balance.

Also, I hate that people don't think this server is full of toxic players, there are the same types of players here all throughout.Hz, KvG, nWo, Loop all have them (Chn seems to be the nicest guild lol). They're the same type of trash talkers, everyone has an ego. It's all the same shit on any server you play, that's just how UO pvpers are.

Pvp is cyclical for sure on demise, but pvp has been dying even with those cycles, it's pretty evident imo. Like this time last year or even htown last year had a ton more players. NWO was bigger, Hz was bigger, Loop was bigger, CHN was bigger, kvg was probably about same or maybe bigger (by bigger I mean they had larger consistent numbers).

They need to do something about pvp or the pvp community will continually dwindle in my opinion. I think casting, changing mortal and cu's are the best options because it makes mages, melee dexxers and archers more balanced towards each other. But I could be wrong. I just think we need room for melee dexxers, which we currently dont have.

[Mister Pink]

I personally don't care much about the mechanics as long as there is balance. So I'm ok with changing everything to osi like standards. I prefer to play with an active population. I love the complexity of this game, and am too bought in to go elsewhere (not as much free time to learn a new game), hard to recreate UO. It's a nostalgia game first with spurts of competition.

That being said the main reason for the change is people are tired of fighting script pvpers. They want their skills to shine, and be a badass. Ok great you accomplish that, and now the majority of players that play here that depends on scripts to barely survive play like ass now. Are they going to adjust or just quit. They quit. Oh boy now we get the PvP crowd, two month on average people(my experience from pest). They complain, are cancerous to the community, mostly only play when victory is assured, have massive egos(as if this is some ultra competitive game). Nobody's getting sponsored mother fucker. They get bored because the people that play like ass quit and they don't have easy targets. Boom dead shard. But hey if it truly is at that point then sure go for it, but demise PvP is cyclical. Be dead for ages then have 25 people over 4 guilds fighting.

Just my thoughts

I don't think QA and SAS are the intended groups we are targeting (toxic pest douches you're talking about). The change would target a lot of former osi players or osi players who currently play, personally a lot of my friends stopped playing here because of the casting and would come back if it were changed.

Also, scripting isn't illegal post-patch, there are other scripts that'll work so they still have an option. Also, 90% of the players here rely on scripts, so the overall level of play will get worse and a few will shine sure but i doubt people will quit with the items and time investment they've put in. Also, if average play x gets slightly worse and average player y gets slightly worse, the skill level will drop but the median players will stay near each other in skill level.

Good players will win regardless, but why should scripting be prioritized? Why should someone who plays without scripts be at a detriment when playing vs a player with scripts? why not just allow a system that allows a way to combat the inhuman reactions? In my opinion osi-casting just levels the playing field for non-script vs scripting pvp. Yes, i want it personally because I would probably be a better player with it than demise casting, but honestly the best reasoning is a question of balance.

Also, I hate that people don't think this server is full of toxic players, there are the same types of players here all throughout.Hz, KvG, nWo, Loop all have them (Chn seems to be the nicest guild lol). They're the same type of trash talkers, everyone has an ego. It's all the same shit on any server you play, that's just how UO pvpers are.

Pvp is cyclical for sure on demise, but pvp has been dying even with those cycles, it's pretty evident imo. Like this time last year or even htown last year had a ton more players. NWO was bigger, Hz was bigger, Loop was bigger, CHN was bigger, kvg was probably about same or maybe bigger (by bigger I mean they had larger consistent numbers).

They need to do something about pvp or the pvp community will continually dwindle in my opinion. I think casting, changing mortal and cu's are the best options because it makes mages, melee dexxers and archers more balanced towards each other. But I could be wrong. I just think we need room for melee dexxers, which we currently dont have.

Good points. I agree the pops of alot of guilds are down. They might have accounts active, but just don't play. A surge of new players would bring most back iny opinon. I know there aren't many era specific Shards like this one, so Demise would be most appealing in that way. I also agree that we need more variety in PvP templates.

Overall I'm for whatever brings an active, healthy playerbase. I can adjust to whatever.

The mount thing should of been fixed a long time ago. I always thought it was because the store sold bonding deeds so it was a source of revenue.

Casting I think people are so used to it, and it wasn't so bad when everyone was on Razor, but yes people left when Steam was allowed because they saw how crazy scripted this place could be.

Additionally I had a friend in real life that was thinking of coming back. I told him about all the scripts and he had zero interest. So yeah if the casting changes disrupt that I'm all for it.